I met a bloke once in the 90's who made recordings on to C-90 tapes of anything interesting that was on BBC Radio 4 and 3, and he found most things interesting. He was surrounded by piles, thousands of tapes everywhere and he was desperately trying to catalog everything. As I spoke to him he was listening to the radio via an ear bud, whilst also recording the radio. He was supposed to be moving out of his house that day, having just exchanged contacts, but he was drowning in his precious tapes. His wife seemed pretty p**d off with him.
I was a bit compulsive myself. I used to buy records, then CDs, and I also made tapes of albums, and recordings of the John Peel show. It was a problem to shift 100s of records and CDs and boxes of tapes whenever I moved house. I lightened my load by giving everything away apart from the Peel tapes which were the most entertaining items in the whole collection, it actually felt good. I kept hold of the Peel tapes for some years, even though my tape deck had died. There were some great shows from the 90s! But then I had to downsize again so I took them to the rubbish tip, even that didn't make me sad.
Ultimately, having and keeping stuff just weighs you down.
The thing about archives is that it's never clear what will turn out to be important or valuable. You're buying and storing a pile of lottery tickets. Yes, they're probably worthless. But only probably.
I suspect a lot of people's thinking is informed by the long saga of missing Doctor Who episodes, too.
Edit: here's today's "keep forever" thread https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41665593
Myself, I hoard in moderation and don't even have a home media server.
It might be the case that men are more likely to be collectors/hoarders in general but there definitely are women who partake. I will also say that the type of thing being collected matters. Go to an estate sale for a woman (especially one born before 1960) and you may see collections of dolls, tea services, certain types of paintings, etc.
0, There has been many examples of this on hoarding TV shows and also finance distress aid TV shows (Luksusfellen (NO, DK) Lyxfallan (SE) ).
> Apparently there were so many tapes because the original owner, a now elderly man, had made the recordings for his neighbour.
Really made me chuckle. "hey Billy, can you like, record 500 days of continuous TV program for me that would be great, thanks!"
Likely asked him to record a few shows in the beginning and then the hoarding kicked in? Otherwise I'm wondering why a) the tapes were still at his place and not his neighbor's and b) why he didn't keep taping over the same few tapes. :-)
https://davestrickson.blogspot.com/2020/05/john-peel-session...
The circle has been closed!
I will one day be inheriting this lot, and have no damned idea what I’m going to do with them.
I suppose even DVR platforms such as MythTV recording off of TV would be excluded here, as per your 'automated'... although it's a bit of a grey area, VCRs could be automated, but not really without changing the tape in a home setting.
Another grey area is more detailed "collecting", such as older video/audio, rarer stuff which does often disappear from torrent sites and such. An example being old TV series recorded direct from TV, to tape -> digitized. But even this, with personal intervention at each collection event, fits in terms of it being hard to fill up drives.
Really, preservation is the cost. Primary live/online, along with a RAID method (hardware over software raid typically) capable of per-disk patrol reads and overall raid consistency checks are vital*. Checksums of all files are a requirement too, and an offline secondary server with a full backup synced every so often.
Otherwise bitrot sets in, and you don't know. Either at the disk level, the raid level, or the filesystem level. And that's where the secondary comes in.
Of course, that doesn't help in case of explosions, aliens, or fire. One needs a secondary offsite for that. But my point is, actual real archival isn't simple.
* if you have a raid, even software raid and you're not doing patrol reads and consistency checks regularly, you're not really doing it right. LSI cards tend to require patrol reads and consistency checks set on, and consistency checks schedules (say, Sundays).
And of course if you don't have a script to dump megacli logs to syslog or what not, you don't really know if the raid is having issues. And you don't even know if consistency checks and patrol reads are running.
(In LSI terminology, patrol reads scan entire disks individually, looking for block read errors, and if found, that block is re-written from redundant data in the array. Consistency checks look at the status of the raid, especially checksums of all disks per virtual disk block. Different checks, both required.)
It doesn’t have to, but it can. I rate my 8 bay Synology. It’s probably the least cost effective storage option, but it’s a pleasure to use and isn’t too loud as long as it hides in the basement. The options you see on DataHoarder are rather more extreme, and well worse perusing.
I've effectively given up on collecting DVDs or anything else that takes up too much space, and it's such a load off my mind not having to worry about where to out it all, how to display it, or even how to transport it whenever I move.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_Stokes
> Stokes bequeathed her son Michael Metelits the entire tape collection, with no instructions other than to donate it to a charity of his choice. After considering potential recipients, Metelits gave the collection to the Internet Archive one year after Stokes's death. Four shipping containers were required to move the collection to Internet Archive's headquarters in San Francisco, a move that cost her estate $16,000. It was the largest collection they had ever received. The group agreed to digitize the volumes, a process expected to run fully on round-the-clock volunteers, costing $2 million and taking 20 digitizing machines several years to complete. As of April 2019, the project is still active.
I'll probably never bother, but it has saved me the time of organizing it.
(Apple does let me search based on its object classification, and I have searched for tag that came on my apple tree based on a word that appears on it, so I guess that strategy has worked somewhat.)
Your comment does remind me of the replicants from Blade Runner and how they need their “precious photos” that aren’t even real as a touchstone to link them to the implanted memories.
Try it, experience it. It's like walking on grass bare footed.
be who?
This, so much this! We should own nothing. Then we'll be happy!
But, with respect to the parent, would it matter if you didn't own them?
What if, say, tools, parts, and books belonged to the land? There for you to use, but if you move to another plot of land you wouldn't take them with you, but instead would have another set of tools, parts, and books waiting for you when you arrive. Would something about that make you less happy?
I had forgotten that Teletext existed until this post. And for those who know about BBSs, Teletext was the closest thing before modems.
I don’t remember seeing the wild Teletext Ascii art etc. as seen in the post though. UK seems to have had mad Teletext.
I thought, though I might be wrong, back in the UK we broadcast on 650 lines, and the top or bottom 25 lines were reserved for teletext and also IIRC timing signals, that could start/stop VCRs automatically but was never used in the UK. The teletext signal was tiny in modern terms, it was extremely similar to the BBC Micro 'Mode 7' in terms.
The article mentions that VHS 'compressed' the signal. I don't think that was the case, I think it filtered the analogue signal and chopped off the teletext info, but some of it used to leak through, hence the opportunity to recover it.
Then there was Macrovision that fiddled with those not-quite filtered lines to add bursts of colour that would leak through to stop tape-to-tape piracy.
Fun fact: a magazine published a circuit that would remove Macrovision that was then widely photocopied and distributed in the UK. You could order the parts from Tandy or RadioShack, and we took it to school and had (a lot) of help from the teacher putting them together as part of our CDT/tech classes. The rest, is as they say, history.
which reads the raw data off a variety of tape formats and converts it to video. Grew out of the domesday project for lasterdiscs
Unfortunately most of them are terrible. I've played with it on and off for years and even gotten individual tools for $100+ but still have issues. It's a bit of a mess with PAL/NTSC, different recommended settings, and at the end of the day you still need a high quality VCR to extract all the data. Those tend to go for hundreds of dollars here. You also need a time base corrector (some VHS have them built in I believe) to avoid dropping frames and causing desync.
A common suggestion is to just get a VHS->DVD recorder and then rip the DVD. You lose out on quality but it usually works and will save you a ton of time.
The suggestion by OP is probably if you truly want to maximize the quality.
VHS was already totally obsolete when 1+GB HDD came to consumer market...
> Then VHS came out with the shoulder mount bricks. It took forever for VHS-C palmcorders to make them much more portable.
The first VHS camcorder (a combined camera and recorder unit) was VHS-C. The JVC GR-C1, released 1984, made famous in Back to the Future.
Full size (VHS) shoulder units actually came a bit later as a lower cost option, and they sold more readily into the 90s. Likely in part because if you were portability and not cost conscious you opted for 8mm (video tape) at that time, 150 minutes and superior audio, slightly better PQ (color).
Prior to that if you wanted to record VHS on location you carried a 10 kg “portable” VTR on your hip with a shoulder strap and a cable to the camera that was another 5 kg. But in those days (late 70s-80s) 1/2” Betamax and 3/4” U-matic(!) were more common for portable use (didn’t help that the early VHS portables were bulkier and heavier than the competition).
If you go to their web page that describes what they do and do not accept, don't go by that. It can be, and has been, wrong in the past including the recent past (this year).
Instead, try to get in touch with them by email. They might accept these as a donation.
You still have the problem of how to pay for the mailing. Just trying to get you one step closer to a solution.
There's no promise they will digitize it immediately, or even ever. But they might take it and then there will at least be a potential path to digitization.
On the one hand I do believe that there might be some bits which might be nice to have in 50 years, but we generate so incredibly much content and it only gets more. Shouldn't we just get rid of most of it someday? It was fun, it did it's purpose, but it's okay if we forget about it. Sure, now you could argue we did that for a long long time, just look at all the anchient libraries, but our content is exponentially growing. How much trash will we have archived in 50 years?
As the Buddha said, all is impermanent.
— Conan O'Brien
Maybe Gilgamesh, who may well have been a historical king of Uruk sometime between 2900 – 2350 BCE.
Enmebaragesi[1] probably existed around 2600 BCE but not much is known about him other than he was a King of Kish.
Figures in the old testament Bible are hard to track but the stories of Nimrod (grandson of Noah) seems to have been placed around 2000 BCE
But hey, it's not all bad. We might be the last generation in living memory, for a while at least, who could ever say "you had to be there" and mean it.
And for all it pangs our hearts to see our ephemera tend to dust, we also I think are, of any human generation to date, probably best able to hope that the things we really love from our time will be preserved. (I hope that's a distinction we don't end up holding on to...)
In just the last little while I've been getting to see that peculiarly ingenuous sort of joy again, as someone half my age discovers a show I first binged 25 years ago from a friend's handmade VHS dubs.
That's a show that makes a habit of trying to tell the audience things they'll hope never to forget. It does so wonderfully. It's a story I cherish, and if someone half my age will perforce love it at least somewhat differently from how I do - so what? That the story remain loved is enough.
I dunno if any of that's any use to you, but share it in the hope it'll do you the same small good it did me, thinking on this of a quiet evening.
Can you explain what causes you to say that we will be the last generation to say this? Not rhetorical, although this caused me to question it because I think that this is probably a constant wrt generations passing onto the next and unlikely to change.
We now face a kind of reverse problem though where we're drowning in so much content that some interesting things can be missed or lost.
It's bittersweet but probably a good thing.
I went with my girlfriend to deliver it and I reminded he used to tape and catalog F1 races and other stuff. I asked if he was watching one of these types and he proceeded to open a large cabinet and give us a tour of his meticulously catalogued and tagged 70's and 80's porn collection.
I suspect they might someday be valuable :-)
https://www.foundfootagefest.com/
Of course there's also the question of how much digital storage that would take, which is probably in the hundreds of terabytes range.
Run through AI and ask to transcribe, summarize, and catalog an index
Store in secure S3 bucket or NAS
Create a website/blog post with ask for access
Doing one tape a night, it'll take 6 years of calendar time. 3 years if you buy a dedicated computer to do it, at two tapes a day.
The good news is that's calendar time, not your time, which is pressing "record" on your computer and "play" on the VHS machine.
For damaged cassettes, you can move the tape from one cassette to another. If the tape is broken, packing tape will get it spliced well enough. If the leader or trailer is bad, you can cut it off and reattach the end to the spool. If the recording is lousy, cleaning the VCR heads with alcohol usually will fix it.
Currently planning to try out LegacyBox, but the reviews are mixed.
VHS-C can be played in a normal VCR, with an adapter cassette, but the process will otherwise be the same. Excellent VCRs in good condition had gotten expensive last time I checked, though.
When I did it, vhsdecode didn't exist and I know nothing about that, but I'm completely satisfied with the results I achieved.
if they're digital 8, then of course ideally you would get a digital capture.
If they're empty or a random collection of this-and-that programs, then they might sell them at low prices to people who still have VHS machines and need the tape. (I'd imagine new tapes are scarce and expensive.)